hist-brewing: RE: hist-brewing digest, Vol 1 #83 - 3 msgs

Matt_lists Matt_lists at hotmail.com
Wed May 29 10:15:56 PDT 2002

Hey Michel,

I'm a big fan of the Koyt any chance someone up your way has fashioned a
knock off recipe??? Or a list of what herbs are in it??

If you are into Gruit beers you really should try this one. I've had plenty
of gruits in my day (homebrewed and professionally done) and this one is by
far the best. Malty, subtle yet flavorful with a nice herbaceous spiciness.

Matt Maples

Over 450 beers and 20 meads online, shipping available.

Liquid Solutions
12162 SW Scholls Ferry Rd
Tigard, OR 97223
www.liquidsolutions.ws (web site)
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Michel Ordeman" <michel at jopenbier.nl>
To: <hist-brewing at pbm.com>
Sent: Thursday, May 30, 2002 1:19 AM
Subject: hist-brewing: RE: hist-brewing digest, Vol 1 #83 - 3 msgs

> As a Dutchman I think I can explain the "hars" question. I dont know the
> English word for it, but it is the dark yellow sticky stuff that comes out
> of tree barch. It was used in the eastern part of Holland were a lot of
> trees grow, because they used the hars from pine trees. In the coastal
> the use of gagel was more common because there were more growing sites of
> the gagel in the West part of Holland. It is known that gruit was always a
> mixture of herbs, there is however no specific information on how this
> mixture was made.
> The last gruitbeers in the region where I live (Haarlem) disapeared when
> hopped beer were introduced around 1450 - 1500. With the disapearance of
> gruitbeers a lot of the knowledge about it was gone to. There is a theorie
> about the gruit mixture, that states that because of the fact that the
> was sold to the brewers as a for of beertax, the exact contains of it were
> kept secret so that the brewers could not make it thereselves and thereby
> were able to brew beer without paying the beertax.
> There are two remakes of the Haarlem gruitbeers on the dutch speciality
> market; a Jopen Koyt a dark 8,5% traditional three grains beer that is
> with gagel (among other herbs), and a Jopen Adriaan a 5% three grains
> witbeer like beer that is made with rue and other herbs.
> Best wishes, groeten,
> Michel Ordeman
> > In the Netherlands, which hasn't been mentioned in this debate yet, I
> think
> >  (PBL this may be useful for you) the regular ingredients in gruit in
> >  early 15th century seem to have been Myrica gale ("gagel"); Echium
> vulgare,
> >  viper's bugloss ("slangekruid"), a member of the borage family; bay
> laurel
> >  berries (as used, of course, by the wife of the Elizabethan writer
> William
> >  Harrison in her beer brewing); and something called "hars", resin,
> >  and nature unspecified. My source here is a book called 'Bier:
> geschiedenis
> >  van een Volksdrank', published in English in 1994 as Beer! The story of
> >  Holland's favourite drink, which has a fascinating chapter on gruit.
> >
>     Thank you.
>     Anybody have anymore info on viper's bugloss, bay laurel berries, or
> "hars"??
>     Scotti
>     Knowledge is never wasted, nor is the time to acquire it.
> --__--__--
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